UN Correspondent Chat: Sherwin Bryce-Pease, South African Broadcast Corporation
What is the latest from the United Nations?
In this edition of the Global Dispatches Podcast series "UN Correspondent Chat," Sherwin Bryce-Pease of the South African Broadcast Corporation and I have a wide ranging discussion about happenings at the United Nations. This includes debates and discussions at the Security Council about the deteriorating situation in Libya, why the dispute in Western Sahara is at a key inflection point, how the ongoing ebola outbreak in the Congo is being discussed at the UN, and why the Trump administration's Middle East peace plan will likely shape debates at the UN in the coming months.
This episode is the third installment of my series of chats with in-house UN correspondents about what's buzzing in Turtle Bay. The idea is to touch base with a UN reporter every six weeks or so to take the temperature around the UN and learn what issues are driving the agenda. As we discuss toward the end of the episode, Sherwin Bryce-Pease, who is UN Bureau Chief, brings a decidedly non-western perspective to certain key issues, like UN reform.
We kick off discussing the recent appearance of Ghassan Salame, the Secretary General'a special envoy for Libya, before the Security Council. Salame had intended to brief the council in progress toward a peace plan, but that plan fell apart in recent weeks as fighting has intensified around Tripoli. Sherwin Bryce-Pease was in the room during that briefing and he describes the scene.
If you have 20 minutes and want to learn what is driving debates at the UN, have a listen.
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Shownotes
Host, Mark Leon Goldberg, and Sherwin Bryce-Pease kick off by discussing the recent appearance of Ghassan Salame, the Secretary-General’s special envoy for Libya, before the Security Council. Salame had intended to brief the council in progress toward a peace plan, but that plan fell apart in recent weeks as fighting has intensified around Tripoli. Sherwin Bryce-Pease was in the room during that briefing and he describes the scene. His impression of Salame’s demeanor and tone, was that he was very disappointed in the weeks leading up to the briefing by these new developments, which were very unexpected. Salame stated that Libya is on the verge of descending into a fully-fledged civil war. Salame also discussed the security vacuum, especially in the south of the country, and the emergence of black ISIS flags.
Can you discuss the emerging Security Council dynamics? Who is the US supporting? The US used to, or does, support the UN backed government in Libya, but also simultaneously, gave a wink and a nod to Haftar’s offensive against Tripoli.
The general sense is that people are a bit confused. The Secretary-General would have expected the P5 to back his work, but conversely, there are statements that Trump had a call with Haftar and supports his fight against terrorism. Further, there is a narrative that France was not as allied to the British position. The British were trying to push a resolution to call for an immediate ceasefire and allow humanitarian aid and the French ambassador, Francois Delattre, was quite vague in his response. In addition to this, you have the A3, three African countries, who are saying everyone needs to back off and let the African Union lead on this issue. This may be a hangover from 2011 when the Security Council passed a resolution authorizing international intervention in Libya. South Africa was on the council at the time and backed this resolution. They may now feel particularly invested in how this crisis is resolved.
Could you give listeners a background on the conflict in Western Sahara?
Certainly. The conflict emerged after the Spanish withdrew. They annexed those provinces of Western Sahara and have invested billions of dollars trying to get to the minerals and fisheries that surround that area. In 1991 the Security Council passed a resolution to create a UN peacekeeping mission there. This would provide an independence referendum that would determine the future of this territory. Decades later, this conflict is still not resolved and we are at a point of frustration. However, in December last year, UN envoy for Western Sahara, Horst Koehler, brought Morocco, Algeria, Mauritania, and the region's separatist group Polisario together in Geneva. This was seen as a breakthrough moment, though Horst Koehler has now resigned due to health reasons.
How has the introduction of John Bolton as National Security Advisor has affected the dynamics of the Security Council on this issue?
We have seen a shift in the US position to now say that Morocco’s proposal of giving greater autonomy to Frente Polasario over that territory, excluding independence, has some credibility. Not everyone around the table agrees that a member state should be putting their finger on the scale in such a way. South Africa was very critical that certain member states were pronouncing on what they thought was a good idea, and that was undermining the negotiations that need to take place directly between the two parties.
The mandate has only been renewed for six months, to add some urgency to negotiations. Theoretically, with the threat that the peacekeeping mission could be pulled, is that a possibility?
Moroccan ambassador, Omar Hilale, called the offer of the Moroccans, pragmatic and realistic. He warned the Polasario in a statement that offering people the myth of independence would not alleviate their pain. The Moroccans believe that the only offer on the table in these negotiations is the greater autonomy of the southern provinces under the Frente Polisario, but complete sovereignty is not an option.
How has the most recent Ebola outbreak playing in the halls of the UN in New York? How are diplomats talking about it in comparison to the last one in West Africa, which was more international?
There is no buzz. In comparison to 2014-2016, when 11,000 died, there is far less of a response here. There may have been a miscalculation on the international community’s part because the DRC was historically good at dealing with Ebola outbreaks. This points to the fact that this outbreak is in East DRC, along the borders of Burundi, Uganda, Rwanda, are known for its hostility and insecurity. There have been attacks by armed groups against peacekeepers that are trying to help deal with the Ebola outbreak. Additionally, there is a lack of education and understanding on what Ebola is and the types of death sentences it hands out. This is a rural and complicated area of the DRC. The UN and WHO need to strengthen their leadership teams. This being said, it is important to note that the UN Security Council is dealing with many crises simultaneously, so it is difficult to claim that they are not giving necessary focus to Ebola.
The role out of this Middle East Peace Plan may take up a lot of oxygen in the UN. How will this affect diplomacy?
There is a great deal of expectation. Most people know very little about what this plan holds. They seem to want to kick it off with an economic conference in Bahrain. However, the Palestinians have said they are not attending and may have convinced China and Russia not to attend either. There is not enough goodwill between the US and Palestine, for a number of reasons. Therefore, it is likely the plan will align with what the Israeli government supports. Trump has wavered between a one state and two state solution. With that being said, the Palestinians want independence and their own government.
Two years into his term, what is your assessment of António Guterres?
He is a seasoned, international diplomat. The concern is that he is not able to translate his granular knowledge into soundbites that demonstrate real leadership. When there is a crisis, like discussions on climate change, there is a lack of will and ability to criticize bad actors. That may be a result of the need to protect jobs and funding. There is a disconnect between the behind the scenes when he has private conversations and him with a microphone.
In regard to South Africa, a rotating member of the Security Council, what is most relevant to you and your stories that you want to deliver to your audiences?
We were so dependent on western media previously and their stories would focus on the P3 and P5. We needed a bureau to better reflect the African perspectives, and 75% of what the Security Council discusses is Africa. There is a recognition that the Security Council, and the UN more broadly, is in desperate need of reform. The veto is terribly destructive and has prevented the international community from dealing and solving conflicts across the world. This has been frustrating, especially to South Africa, the most developed economy in Africa. Often the national interest of P5 members determines what gets done and what not. This does not get enough attention in western media.
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Shownotes by Lydia DeFelice